Two Signed Japanese Silk Flags For Regiewee

[GHP]

So Cupman is the only person since the 1930s to have used this stamp?

Why do you think this stamp dates from the 1930s? Show me a similar stamp used in the 1930s. I will nudge a bit and postulate that the stamp could have been used for stamping souvenir books at train stations (e.g.,here, ... but that is a stretch.

We have multiple examples of these stamps on flags written in the same hand using the same template.
Color me skeptical.


-- Guy

[GHP]

...I’m trying to get beyond opinion to fact if possible.

Fact: these stamps have only shown up on "Cupman" flags. Nowhere else.

Of all the temple stamps and seals I've seen, I've never seen the same stamp twice. EVER. Not to say examples do not exist, I just haven't seen them.

-- Guy

[manayunkman]

That’s what I want to know.

The stamp is a fantasy.

[GHP]

That’s what I want to know.

The stamp is a fantasy.

I do not know if the stamp itself is a fantasy or not. I think it is. But, let's suppose it is a genuine 1935-produced stamp. Okay, so Cupman has a 1930s stamp that he puts on his faked flags. (Flags with OPSEC violations!)

Analogue: I come across an authentic 1940s Dienstemple and apply it to a bunch of faked Nazi flags and sell them as original; or, I find a bunch of genuine party flags and apply the stamp and sell as an ᛋᛋ flag for more money. Essentially that is what is being done with that stamp (if it is authentic).


-- Guy

[Eric Queen]

All,

For the record, I would like to clarify what I said and my position. I do not now, nor have I ever, collected Japanese flags. I don't recall ever owning one and I do not study fake stamps, etc.

I attempted to help Bob out with a translation of certain elements of the flags to the best of my ability. My opinion was, and remains, that the flags were written by a Japanese hand (or someone with native level Kanji writing abilities). They do not look like any "SeaBee" flag that I have personally ever seen. The one with the shrine designation seems to be written by the same hand which, on face value, would make sense to me as there are no well wisher signatures, just slogans, etc.

As to when they were written or the significance of the stamping's I do not know nor have I ever claimed to know.

The shrine name 國柱神社 I took on face value (國柱 is read Kunihashira) but Guy is clearly correct in terms of the unique pronunciation (Kinai) for this particular shrine which I did not research. I don't think the pronunciation of the shrine's name is relevant to this discussion though.

Hopefully the experts will be able to talk through this and align on a determination as to the significance of the stamps.

Thank you

EQ

[Rod G]

Oceansider agrees with Eric Queen that the flag is genuine.

The appraisal that the flag is fake is an opinion..

It's unfair of oceansider to become so selective in his opinion now when he was open to accepting opinions on this board earlier. Clearly opinions need to be grounded in experience to have value and there is plenty of experience weighing in on this. It's also unfair to single Eric out because his appraisal is favorable.

The only written documentation with the original lot of two flags was a complete and utter hoax so I wouldn't lend credence to the war vet story either. Manayunkman, you and oceansider may both be victims of a scam. I believe enough doubt existed before you two made the deal that it shouldn't have happened without full disclosure.

Just my two cents.

[manayunkman]

Since 1967 I’ve had several thousand vet finds and have never seen a vet with a fake.

I’ve known Bob for many years and set up just about next to him at a flea market in Oceanside.

I know how he buys and I know how he sells.

He’s an honest guy and I know the flag came from the vets family.

I appreciate all the input and wish everyone well.

[Rod G]

Since 1967 I’ve had several thousand vet finds and have never seen a vet with a fake.

I’ve known Bob for many years and set up just about next to him at a flea market in Oceanside.

I know how he buys and I know how he sells.

He’s an honest guy and I know the flag came from the vets family.

I appreciate all the input and wish everyone well.

Now I understand. I am aware of Bob Hudson and agree he's a great guy with tons of integrity. I had no idea he's oceansider.

http://www.usmilitariaforum.com/foru...oldiers-badge/

What I don't understand is why you set one forum against another. It was unfair and uncalled for to put both Guy and Eric in a position where they had to defend their opinions on here. In the end no one's mind was changed. What a mess!

[Staldion]

Hi,

Here is one who just popped up on FB. Seabee's pattern and again the "standing soldier" stamp. I may add that kanji looks to have been written by the same hand than the OP's one. Even if I can spot ill shaped kanji (top slogan). In my memory Cupman wasn't good at writting kanji that's why he sticked to stamps I think. Don't know if he is the same as samuraimonkey as hé doesn't hesitate to write / draw (attempt to at least) on flags.

This one is the Seabee's "Tojo" pattern. As the fake signature of Hideki Tojo is on all of them.

So either the vet bought a period fake, or what we believe to be "seabees" are later fakes by a work shop which never stopped production.

Guy > Thank you for the interesting link on train station's stamps. Just stole the nice sumo stamp picture !

[GHP]

Yes, the infamous "Tōjō Flag"! I've reoriented and marked-up the image so others can see what we're talking about.


Thanks,
-- Guy

[GHP]

...Guy > Thank you for the interesting link on train station's stamps. Just stole the nice sumo stamp picture !

Glad to help. That one is for 両国駅 Ryōgoku-eki [train] Station. The station is close to the Ryōgoku Kokugikan sumo stadium



I used the French-language link for you!

Cheers,
-- Guy

[imperialjapan]

Both flags are fake, sorry.