MGSs Helmets WW1

[Hoss]

Gents
This settles it for me 100%.
A reply received today from a renowned authority on these rare helmets.

"Eric,
I had a group from an MGSS man who lost an arm. I had photos, soldbuch - a lot of stuff. In there was a photo of them wearing helmets with an MGSS badge and their sleeve emblems. They did exist. I have owned at least 6 great MGSS helmets that were unquestionably real. Some I bought in the 1980's including an Austrian helmet with the badge. They were unquestionably real - had all the earmarks that you look for in a helmet as far as authenticity - age, wear, etc. All of the helmet collectors I have dealt with also agree they are real and too many people have them in their collections who are real anal about what they buy - in other words, they are serious collectors who would never buy one if they were not real. I do not know why people would question them now.
Cheers *******"

Right Guys,
All we need now is period photos?

Eric

[DaveG]

I'd say that photograph would be historic. I'm curious as to what the criteria for "unquestionably real" is? Many experienced collectors also bought into the "factory painted" tropical M-42 helmets that came out of Czechoslovakia in the 80s too. I'm not saying that MG painted helmets don't exist but I am saying that the dated 1980s concept of "all the earmarks you look for in a helmet for authenticity" is harder to make fly these days. Reasonable minds can differ on authenticity. I'm open to the possibility that WWI helmets with MG insignia existed, but I've yet to see a collector post an example that he feels is "unquestionably real" so comparisons and contrasts can be made.

P.S. I have a camouflaged M-16 that I purchased from the WWI vet back in the early 1970s that if I posted it would be savaged by anyone using the "earmarks you look for in a helmet" because the colors are rather vivid, not geometric and non-standard. Could have been souvenir painted but still no one would believe it was from the 1918 period.

[Hoss]

DaveG
What about the paperwork and ID,d items all to the same gunner including photos?

Eric

[Hoss]

Guy,s
What has this weathly collector got to gain here? Other than the truth!
Right Iam going to get to the bottom of this once and for all. Like that old TV series 'The Fugitive' Iam going to hit the road looking for a one armed Machine Gunner!!!!

Eric

[DaveG]

DaveG
What about the paperwork and ID,d items all to the same gunner including photos?

Eric

I agree that's great. I'd love to see all of it. Perhaps the collector will allow it to be posted. If you or he doesn't have picture posting capabilities, I'll be happy to post photos of the group. Like I say, I'm open, just waiting to see a period photo.

Dave

[C. Roelens]

I'd say that photograph would be historic. I'm curious as to what the criteria for "unquestionably real" is? Many experienced collectors also bought into the "factory painted" tropical M-42 helmets that came out of Czechoslovakia in the 80s too. I'm not saying that MG painted helmets don't exist but I am saying that the dated 1980s concept of "all the earmarks you look for in a helmet for authenticity" is harder to make fly these days. Reasonable minds can differ on authenticity. I'm open to the possibility that WWI helmets with MG insignia existed, but I've yet to see a collector post an example that he feels is "unquestionably real" so comparisons and contrasts can be made.

P.S. I have a camouflaged M-16 that I purchased from the WWI vet back in the early 1970s that if I posted it would be savaged by anyone using the "earmarks you look for in a helmet" because the colors are rather vivid, not geometric and non-standard. Could have been souvenir painted but still no one would believe it was from the 1918 period.

Dave,

I would like to see your camo. I remember awhile back a collector from Florida posted a wild (razzle dazzle) type camo helmet with frontal plate painted the same. The pattern was similar to that painted on period ships. It threw some collectors over the edge. It was right as rain, and I believe he sold the helmet and plate for 8K. I regret not keeping the photos.

Chuck

[C. Roelens]

Guy,s
What has this weathly collector got to gain here? Other than the truth!
Right Iam going to get to the bottom of this once and for all. Like that old TV series 'The Fugitive' Iam going to hit the road looking for a one armed Machine Gunner!!!!

Eric

Eric,

The one armed MG'er is long gone, but if you can track down his helmet and/or photos that would be outstanding.

Chuck

[DaveG]

Dave,

I would like to see your camo. I remember awhile back a collector from Florida posted a wild (razzle dazzle) type camo helmet with frontal plate painted the same. The pattern was similar to that painted on period ships. It threw some collectors over the edge. It was right as rain, and I believe he sold the helmet and plate for 8K. I regret not keeping the photos.

Chuck

Chuck, here is an old picture, I probably need to take a few more but you get the idea. Probably souvenir painted at the end of the war but certainly the colors would make it a candidate for healthy skepticism.

Dave

[Hoss]

Dave,

I would like to see your camo. I remember awhile back a collector from Florida posted a wild (razzle dazzle) type camo helmet with frontal plate painted the same. The pattern was similar to that painted on period ships. It threw some collectors over the edge. It was right as rain, and I believe he sold the helmet and plate for 8K. I regret not keeping the photos.

Chuck

Chuck
Excellent discription. Many WW2 collectors on this Forum will know of M. Fisher (Regimentals Uk). I visited his shop in London many years ago and he had a M18 cutout with frontal plate and the Armor (Grabenpanzer) all done in same 'razzle dazzle' camo. It was allready sold but Malcom liked it so much he had it on display for a while. Probably more than likely for Marine Troops done in blues, greens and white! just like the ships, amazing.

Eric

[Paul B]

Camo Body Armour

Eric

I too saw the set of cut-out helmet and body armour at Regimentals (maybe 10-12 years ago). As I recall I liked it in terms of authenticity -helmet was an ET64, brow-plate had all the things you'd look for and the camo pattern was simply amazing.

At the time Malcolm had some really nice Imperial items, having recently purchased the famous Marshall Daut collection (...field-grey heaven!!!) as well as another couple of sizeable collections. Alongside the armour I remember an amazing framed group to a Garde-Pioneer -photo, war service certificate and totenkopf armbadge....it sold three days before my visit....

All the best

Paul.

[Hoss]

Paul
It sold to an Italian collector. I,ve never seen anything like it since, can you remember the price? Old Malcom had some nice stuff shame the shops not there anymore. I bought a complete WW1 German uniform with the mannequin from him once. A garde M16 helmet, Tunic M15 (mint!) 19th bavarian, hosen, boots etc; the lot for 1500 pounds sterling. Incredible when you think what fieldgrey goes for now. I hand carried the mannequin through London including the Underground all the way to the Heathrow Airport! What a laugh

Eric

[Paul B]

Regimentals in the 90s

Hi Eric

I seem to recall the helmet/body armour combo going for around £1800 -I might even have a photo of it in an old catalogue somewhere.

I too can remember seeing complete WWI mannequins for sale in the shop -around the same time as the body armour there was a late war German infantry NCO -camo M16 helmet, M1915 bluse, full field equipment and Gew 88 rifle- which also sold for £1500. As you say, the bluse alone would go for more than that these days.

If you still have the mannequin you purchased I would love to see photos....but I think everyone would especially like to see photos of you taking it on the tube and walking through Heathrow....*

All the best

Paul.

*...and my girlfriend thought I was mad when I left a M1915 bluse in the Imperial War Museum cloakroom during a buying trip to London....your story easily top-trumps it...

[Hoss]

Paul
It was so funny. I didnt know if I had to buy a ticket for him! Try getting on a packed underground train with a dummy. I stood him up the city gents just kept on reading their Times you know as Londoners do. There was one or to odd looks and comments but I just ignored em. He had a couple of pieces of cardboard around his middle so he was,nt embarassed and rope handles.

Eric

[PlaceOfBayonets]

SO Eric do you think the current Machine Gunners helmet on ebay at 700 dollars with 4 hours left to go is any good?

W.

[Hoss]

SO Eric do you think the current Machine Gunners helmet on ebay at 700 dollars with 4 hours left to go is any good?

W.

Its not for me

Eric