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    #16
    Originally posted by Jo Rivett View Post
    Facts, needs to be supported with evidence.
    Just for future reference of course, if you are going to jump on a thread and claim, throw the word "fact" around, then you must also have something in your bag to show. Words alone, can sadly not be considered as fact.
    Well, as a university professor, I can attest to words being facts if supported by expertise. I cited one expert, Verkuilen Ager who documented and wrote about Freikorps insignia and awards long before there was much interest in the subject. His information came from exhaustive research during the 1960s including considerable input from a variety of still-living (at the time) Freikorps leaders and veterans as well as experts such as Dr. Klietmann. While I haven't written a book on the subject, I probably could. So, while I hesitate to call myself an expert, I think that many collectors who have known me over the years take my word as fact in most cases to do with things Freikorps-related.
    Unfortunately, with many of the Freikorps records destroyed in 1945, the best we can do is follow the knowledge of long-time collectors with in-depth and specific knowledge of the period.

    It's clear we're never going to agree on the authenticity of this badge. All you have proven is that the badge was die-cast and has pitting. I agree with you. But my experience and expertise, (such as it is) states that was how they were made during the period and that they are not modern fakes.

    So, I would suggest leaving it to readers of this thread to make up their own mind.

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      #17
      Originally posted by bolewts58 View Post
      So, I would suggest leaving it to readers of this thread to make up their own mind.
      My good man, have you taken loss of all your senses ?

      Do you honestly, genuinely, believe that i , that WE, could, for one moment - let this slide? or let this turn into a "believe what you wish"

      You are claiming, that small badges were cast. Do you have any idea what ramifications, what consequences this absurd claim would have on our hobby, were i, were WE, to let it slide, and heavens forbid, go down in history as a "possibility"? - to be left up to opinion, to "debate based on chirping"
      Not on my watch my good man - not, on my watch.

      Comment

        #18
        Originally posted by Jo Rivett View Post
        My good man, have you taken loss of all your senses ?

        Do you honestly, genuinely, believe that i , that WE, could, for one moment - let this slide? or let this turn into a "believe what you wish"

        You are claiming, that small badges were cast. Do you have any idea what ramifications, what consequences this absurd claim would have on our hobby, were i, were WE, to let it slide, and heavens forbid, go down in history as a "possibility"? - to be left up to opinion, to "debate based on chirping"
        Not on my watch my good man - not, on my watch.
        You really are tiresome and pedantic and have contributed nothing of value to this forum. This thread has been self-righteous and annoying from the start.

        I'm only claiming that the 'badge in question' was cast. I never said all small badges were cast. Many in fact were die-struck. But, die-cast was used by badge makers. One can for example show numerous examples of die-cast veteran's badges and stickpins from both the Imperial and Weimar period.

        My focus is only on this badge and I've already stated my case. I have no other way to visually prove that the badge was only made this way or to prove that the badge even existed, as there is no official archival record of which I'm aware that could prove such a thing.

        I accept that the badge is genuine based on what I know and have already stated.

        The onus is on you to prove it is not. From what I know of you and see from your other posts, you know and write about Third Reich badges. I accept that this is your area of expertise. But, what you know about TR badges cannot be applied ad hoc to all German badges particularly those from the Freikorps period. I suggest that you stick to the Third Reich of which you are an expert and not post about something of which you are not.
        Last edited by Brian L.; 04-13-2015, 04:55 AM.

        Comment

          #19
          Originally posted by bolewts58 View Post
          You have contributed nothing of value to this forum.
          That is a really strange post indeed. The only thing that "hurts" here, is my jaw. It just hit the floor - and i am seven foot tall!

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            #20
            I'm done.

            Comment

              #21
              Originally posted by mchap View Post
              Im not convinced the badge is fake.... my Wehrwolf pin is made of different material but is a cast piece with same pin construction, and has visible inclusions. Your quality = fake theory shouldnt be so heavily applied to the early 1920s lapel pins.

              There aren't many serious Freikorps collectors on this forum that contribute to the extent bolewts58 does. Its safe to say his opinion counts for more than a bunch of microscope images.
              thats the thing microscopic images BUST everyones opinion , so there need be NO opinion, a very very dangerous way of thinking you got there!

              Comment

                #22
                Very interesting-should I really call it discussion?-we got here.
                I think the main idea behind this thread is that nothing wrong with some original FK badges being cast, really. Why, if even some official and mass-produced early badges of the same period ( like WW1 U-boot) were cast?
                Jo, are you familiar with this fact? Or are you going to vivisect some Walter Schott produced badges with microscope to tell they are not original as well?

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by Destruction View Post
                  I think the main idea
                  I am not hear to talk nonsense about period German manufacturers of small stickpins "casting " them, simply because, as we see the Fichtelgau abz. made - it was just not done.

                  If you go to bed tonight thinking that "it really was done, German badge makers really did make molds and then pour a mix of lead, tin and pewter into them, pin included" then that is up to you, a bit like religion, a personal choice. I have no problem with that at all. Just dont expect me to enter into a conversation with you about it, or take the bait. I would be doing my intelligence a grave injustice indeed.

                  Comment

                    #24
                    Originally posted by Jo Rivett View Post
                    I am not hear to talk nonsense about period German manufacturers of small stickpins "casting " them, simply because, as we see the Fichtelgau abz. made - it was just not done.

                    If you go to bed tonight thinking that "it really was done, German badge makers really did make molds and then pour a mix of lead, tin and pewter into them, pin included" then that is up to you, a bit like religion, a personal choice. I have no problem with that at all. Just dont expect me to enter into a conversation with you about it, or take the bait. I would be doing my intelligence a grave injustice indeed.
                    Do what you wish to keep your mind safe, it's also your choice.
                    But what about my question? Are you familiar with the fact that some period badges were cast? Will you agree with that? It would be enough for my religion

                    Comment

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