West German Luftwaffe Rank

[redwater]

I bought one of the surplus grey leather flying jackets from the 1980's. I am working on restoring it due to having all insignia removed when surplused out. I have all the patches I need except the rank insignia for the sleeves. As I understand the slip on rank was sewn on the sleeves. Now my question, is there a souce for the blue or olive German Air Force slip on rank? It seems all I can find is Army or flak pattern.

[uscob]

http://www.berlin-military.com/index.php?k=491&lang=eng
Go on the Rank and look in the Variations. There are some AF in.
If you don't find what you're looking for, let me know, I can find it for you.

[RamJet]

They also are offered quite regularly on Ebay.

[redwater]

It does not appear they have what I need on the Berlin website unless im not looking at the right thing. I have been scouring Ebay for weeks and all I can find is shoulder boards and war era items it seems, unless im not serching for the right item. This is my first attempt at restoring a German jacket. I started out with Canadian ones and this one seems to prove more difficult

[Collectinsteve]

Pretty easy to find on German eBay, but you have to search www.ebay.de and not try to find things through a different national website.

Keywords are:

Rangenabzeichen
Schulterklappen

This should help you out:

http://dsa.ebay.de/dsc/BRD-/34673/i....ragenabzeichen

http://dsa.ebay.de/dsc/BRD-/34673/i....=rangabzeichen

You're looking only for the ones with wings on them, olive background (blue is for Marine), and white markings. The type with black markings weren't used on leather jackets as far as I know, but I'm not 100% sure.

The trick is to find a good matching set. This means finding ones that are in approximately the same used condition as your jacket and also the same timeframe. The latter is quite tricky in some cases. The earlier ones (1960s and early 1970s I think) are lighter in color and more olive green. The later ones (1970s through today) have a dark gray background. Check your inside jacket pockets for a label and hope there is a date on it.

One good thing is that all LW rank is the same physical size, no matter what the rank is. I'd go for a senior NCO or low/mid officer.

Steve

[uscob]

It does not appear they have what I need on the Berlin website unless im not looking at the right thing. I have been scouring Ebay for weeks and all I can find is shoulder boards and war era items it seems, unless im not serching for the right item. This is my first attempt at restoring a German jacket. I started out with Canadian ones and this one seems to prove more difficult

As I said, if you don't find them on the Website, let me know. I can get nearly everything directly from the AF.

[RamJet]

I don't know when exactly, but in the end of the 80s/beginning of the 90s we started to wear the blue-grey rank insignia on the leather jackets. I think I replaced my green ones with blue ones in 1992.

I don't think that the age of the insignia must necessarily match the age of the jacket. Every time I got promoted I replaced the insignia on my old jacket. So in 1999 I had an old leather jacket with brand new LtCol insignia ... I wasn't promoted since then.

[chiffonnier]

I say go for blue !
looks way,way better.
Just my opinion.
All the best,
Kees

[Collectinsteve]

I don't know when exactly, but in the end of the 80s/beginning of the 90s we started to wear the blue-grey rank insignia on the leather jackets. I think I replaced my green ones with blue ones in 1992.

Thanks for that reminder! I assumed his jacket is much older. But of course it might not be.

I don't think that the age of the insignia must necessarily match the age of the jacket. Every time I got promoted I replaced the insignia on my old jacket. So in 1999 I had an old leather jacket with brand new LtCol insignia ... I wasn't promoted since then.

Yes, definitely. The BW doesn't pay to replace all your items just because you get promoted.

But if someone wants to be "correct" they can't go wrong. They can go wrong if they break the rules. For example, what is the chance of someone wearing a 1960 jacket with 2006 rank? Not very high What is the chance of 2006 jacket having 1960s rank on it? Also not a very likely thing to see. Not impossible, just not likely. When I restore something I think about this a lot.

Steve

[RamJet]

That's right, Steve.

What I intended to say was that the attached rank insignia do not have necessarily show the same wear like the jacket.

What I have seen quite often well into the 80s for example was the 60s/70s USAF style name tag (large white letters on medium blue fabric). Then the use of the standard Bundeswehr style name tags (smaller white letters on dark blue fabric) started, and so still looks my leather jacket. Finally we ended up with the velcro attachments shown by chiffonier. Meanwhile, the leather jackets were replaced by sage-green all-weather jackets.

[redwater]

Thanks so much for the help so far, the links that ramjet listed on ebay pointed me in the right direction. When I purchased the jacket I was told that is was of 80's vintage but havent been able to find evidence to support it. There is only 1 tag on the orange jacket liner and the only number is "200G". There is the stitch holes for a wing badge so I measured the area end to end. It measured almost 13cm acrossed. I started to research the various measurements and found only West German wings from 1966 to unification measured that size with post unification being around 11cm. I know its a shot off the hip as to placing a age on a item but I havent found any other indicator. When I figure out how to post pics on this forum I will upload some asap. I do agree the blue rank looks good.

[Collectinsteve]

With the huge number of USAF personnel in Germany, it must have been very easy for someone in the BW LW to get a US style name tag. And they do look nice, don't they?

And you are absolutely correct that "new" rank could easily be found on an "old" jacket. It's a very good point to make. I don't think many soldiers purchase used ranks when they get promoted. You guys work hard for your promotions, so you should only have the best

Steve

That's right, Steve.

What I intended to say was that the attached rank insignia do not have necessarily show the same wear like the jacket.

What I have seen quite often well into the 80s for example was the 60s/70s USAF style name tag (large white letters on medium blue fabric). Then the use of the standard Bundeswehr style name tags (smaller white letters on dark blue fabric) started, and so still looks my leather jacket. Finally we ended up with the velcro attachments shown by chiffonier. Meanwhile, the leather jackets were replaced by sage-green all-weather jackets.

[SprogCollector]

What rank do you need? TJ donated an assortment of LW officer rank slip-ons to me when I was putting my leather jacket back together. I have some on blue, some on olive w/o the wing at the base, and some in olive with the wing at the base. I also have some olive naval rank slip-ons.

[Guardian 5]

redwater,

Between SprogCollector and I, we should be able to set you up. I've got a heavy schedule this week but will pull out the spares box and see what's available.

As always, the offer is open to everyone.

All the best,
TJ

[redwater]

Rank wise I am not that particular. The jacket came with 2 loose patches from Jabo 31. A Boelcke patch and a staffel 2 patch. I bought a West German set of wings to replace what was missing. With that being said any pilot rank would do. I tryed to post some pics but for some reason I cant link to Flickr. On a different note there appears to be JG8 written in in on the manufacturer tag. Any ideas?