Double breasted tunic.

[Charlie_Brown]

Does anyone have any info on this type of tunic?
Was it an early uniform or was it only for selected units, in Koblenz they had one in the Wehrtechniches museum badged up for artillery but most pictures I have seen are for fallis and gebirgsjaeger.

[Charlie_Brown]

I know know what it is, an early dress uniform but why is it being worn with combat uniform?
Does anyone have any additional info such as the history behind it.

[Klaus1989]

These are early jackets for enlisted man/NCO service uniform of all Heer units, often called "Affenjacke" ("monkey jacket") by soldiers. They were worn 1955-1958 or so. Replaced in 1957 by four-pocket tunic, but some worn after replacement date. 1958 date on picture is after collar tabs introduced (1957?) - earlier Waffengattung is shown with brass collar insignia.

Never seen mixture of camo and service uniforms in Bw like this before, so not sure. They have their field jacket on chairs and it is in January, so maybe for warmth during pause at barracks? Not regulation certainly.

regards
Klaus

[Axel]

Does anyone have any info on this type of tunic?
Was it an early uniform or was it only for selected units, in Koblenz they had one in the Wehrtechniches museum badged up for artillery but most pictures I have seen are for fallis and gebirgsjaeger.

Nice picture but unfortunately I dont know too much about the double-breasted tunics that the bundeswehr had just that they dont use them anymore...although I wish they still did =/

[Asbjoern]

Yes, the tunic is clearly the Affenjacke belonging to the first dress uniform, manufactured only in the first years and quickly replaced.

Why the guys on this special picture wear this kind of multiform will remain in the dark unless one of them is still living will tell it to us..- ... but there are more pictures that show that a combination of dress uniform parts with the working suit or the combat uniform was widespread.
Maybe its a kind of tradition...: the camo stuff should have been worn over the green herringbonetwill-working suit - maybe these guys did it more in the Wehrmacht stile by wearing it over the dress uniform ...

Jens

[Gordon Craig]

Charlie Brown,

Another possibile reason this uniform was worn under the cammo was for warmth. The cammo uniform was unlined and fine for wear during relatively warm days. The problem with warmth was one of the reasons the cammo uniform was phased out.

Regards,

Gordon

[SprogCollector]

A good example of the layering concept for uniforms. The US did the exact same thing with their uniforms, dating back to WW2. The BW camo-over-woolen uniform is the same as the US M-43 field uniform being worn over the Ike-jacket and trousers.

[Asbjoern]

Yes, it was a multi layer concept... but they should have worn their olivegreen working dress under the camo dress, not the dress uniform! And for extra cold weather there was the teddy-bear dress that should have been worn between both !

Jens

[Guardian 5]

Gents - Excellent discussion on a very interesting picture.

Attached here find a c.1959 picture which illustrates at least three different dress uniform styles used by Bundeswehr in the early days.

All the best - TJ

[Guardian 5]

Here is the rear of the post card which may be of use to some.

TJ

[Guardian 5]

Yes, it was a multi layer concept... but they should have worn their olivegreen working dress under the camo dress, not the dress uniform! And for extra cold weather there was the teddy-bear dress that should have been worn between both !

Jens

Gents - Just to add to what Jens wrote, Speedytop called these teddy-bear suits Wollplüschjacke und Wollplüschhose.

It was later found that these supplemental liners were not adequate. This and other factors contributed to the relatively short service life of the M1956 camouflage battle dress uniform.

All the best - TJ

[Klaus1989]

To note, the longer Zweireiher in TJs photo is early officer uniform, when enlisted men and NCOs wore waist-length "Affenjacke." Of course, later Dienstjacke from first 1957/58 was for all ranks. 1959 were the Zweireiher being phased out.

The photo is group from a transport training exercise, from caption. I assume mixture of officers and (senior) NCOs. Interesting that it says "Graf Stauffenberg" on back.

regards
Klaus

[Gordon Craig]

TJ,

Great photo and time line for these uniforms since the course lasted from the 9th to the 19th of June 1959. Just a few of the sodiers had received the new uniform.

Regards,

Gordon

[Asbjoern]

Yes, a very interesting photo in deed ! Especially because of the precise dateline...
Most pictures taken from albums are hard to date as there are only a few informations... . This picture is taken from an album of a guy who begann his time in the BW in mid 1960.

It shows him and some comrades during his Grundausbildung (basic training) wearing the relatively new kit which was invented from 1959 on, while their instructors wear a combination of olive green and camo.

On the four-button version of the double breasted jacket there is also a little mistery...as stated by Gordon and the 1956 zDV this type was only to be worn from NCO onwards. Therefor these Jackets allways should have a bronce or silver cord around the colar. But there are several original, most possible unchanged jackets without this cord, smostly combined with the shoulderboards and other insignia for "Uffz ohne Portepee" ! Maybe a kind of downcycling stuff no longer suitable for the "upperclass" ???

Regards,

Jens