Fake KM White Top

[Jody]

Hello folks,
I am trying to get a refund for a young friend of mine for this cap that he bought. Maybe pointing out what is wrong with it will help convince the dealer.

Thank you,
Jody

[stonemint]

That is a one-looker POSTWAR Bundesmarine (West German Navy) cap.

Just from just these 2 pictures, it is an easy "tell":

1. The sweatdiamond is made out of plastic, not celluloid;
2. The logo was only used after 1945 by Isken;
3. The hat has contract #s--these were not utilized on Third Reich caps;
4. The insignia is recently-made Pakistani bullion (with the cockade made out of thread).

Those are just the starters.

[stonemint]

Here is Carl Isken's Third Reich logo (note celluloid sweatdiamond):

[stonemint]

Here is a REAL Kriegsmarine NCO white-top.

Note all bullion cockade (no thread); celluloid sweatdiamond; correct size top; patina to the gilt bullion; & correct waffle-pattern fabric to the top:

[Jody]

Thank you

Thank you, hopefully this great write up of yours will help him get a much needed refund. He is a teenager, who got too eager with a purchase.

[KeithRic]

Another white top NCO

Hi
Forgive me for hijacking this thread - but it seemed a good place to post pictures of a cap about which I have my doubts. It came from an old collection (I know that means nothing really - although it was unlikely to have been made yesterday). Hopefully the pictures will speak for themselves. The wreath is woven cotton (?), the cockade metal. There is a press-stud affixed to the top of the wreath, with its match to the front of the cap, evidently to stop it moving. Otherwise the wreath is attached to the band around the cap (only) i.e. it is not sewn onto the cap itself. Comments would be appreciated.
Thanks.

[KeithRic]

Another white top NCO (a few more pictures)

A couple more pictures.

[sutka]

Nice presentation Chris
I hope young collector gets his money back
I almost fail in to same crack at the last show
Thanks to Chris I returned the cap on time
BIG THANKS

[GAMS1]

Hi
Forgive me for hijacking this thread - but it seemed a good place to post pictures of a cap about which I have my doubts. It came from an old collection (I know that means nothing really - although it was unlikely to have been made yesterday). Hopefully the pictures will speak for themselves. The wreath is woven cotton (?), the cockade metal. There is a press-stud affixed to the top of the wreath, with its match to the front of the cap, evidently to stop it moving. Otherwise the wreath is attached to the band around the cap (only) i.e. it is not sewn onto the cap itself. Comments would be appreciated.
Thanks.

A nice typical postwar BM cap with KM badges added …
Nick

[KeithRic]

Fake cap (groan)

A nice typical postwar BM cap with KM badges added …
Nick

Thanks for the reply Nick. Any thoughts on the insignia - is that fake too?

[R.Beck]

Jeepers! What a bunch of post holiday crapola

[GAMS1]

Thanks for the reply Nick. Any thoughts on the insignia - is that fake too?

Oakleaves look good ...the cotton version .
The eagle doesn't look good and we should see the back to be sure ?
Nick

[glaser]

Jody,

The lowest series of numbers in cap #1 is a NATO STOCK NUMBER (xxxx-xx-xxx-xxxx), that is the proof this is not a wartime cap

[KeithRic]

Eagle

Oakleaves look good ...the cotton version .
The eagle doesn't look good and we should see the back to be sure ?
Nick

Photos below. Is the cap BM - does anyone have any idea. There is a "stiffener" behind the eagle, but it is covered by the lining. Thanks

[stonemint]

Jody,

The lowest series of numbers in cap #1 is a NATO STOCK NUMBER (xxxx-xx-xxx-xxxx), that is the proof this is not a wartime cap

glaser, great info--thanks for the tip....