"fake" Bacqueville

[alexandre]

Hello,

A strange badge here..
the pin system match perfectly to the french maker,
but not the design of the badge itself.
Have you ever seen a similar badge?
Bacqueville variation or symply fake ?

[Norm F]

Wow, that's intriguing! The patterned carton, tissue paper and reverse setup are all typical for the "French-made" badge but the planchet is a zinc Deumer!

A real mystery. I'm sure skeptics will take this as evidence of post-war assembly for the "French-made" badges, but who knows? Whoever made this and whenever it was made, someone got hold of a wartime-compatible Deumer-design stamped planchet.

Thanks for posting.

Best regards,
---Norm

[Norm F]

Is it possible to see some sharp closeups of the solder around the hardware?

Best regards,
---Norm

[BubbaZ]

Wow, that's intriguing! The patterned carton, tissue paper and reverse setup are all typical for the "French-made" badge but the planchet is a zinc Deumer!

A real mystery. I'm sure skeptics will take this as evidence of post-war assembly for the "French-made" badges, but who knows? Whoever made this and whenever it was made, someone got hold of a wartime-compatible Deumer-design stamped planchet.

Thanks for posting.

Best regards,
---Norm

Well, I am the one of skeptics
Indeed a Deumer design zincer with typical "French-made" hardware... the quality of the obverse seems worse than on tekstbook Deumers and it lacks finish completely which is also strange since zinc Deumers used to maintain its finish quite well. It has also a strange flaw on the eagle's right wing.
Here is mine for comparison: http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...7&postcount=16
Cheers,
Hubert

[alexandre]

Hello Norm and Hubert,
Thanks for your help
I will take better pics tomorrow

Regards,

[John T]

If somebody puts together something that is not correct, that does not make an original (or as others call "contested") piece bad. Such "evidence" would suggest that the argument would then be that if we see Juncker, Brehmer, Deumer, take your pick, fittings on a Schwerin HSF then HSF's by Schwerin are fake/fantasies/garbage/postwar/made for vets.

[Norm F]

If somebody puts together something that is not correct, that does not make an original (or as others call "contested") piece bad. Such "evidence" would suggest that the argument would then be that if we see Juncker, Brehmer, Deumer, take your pick, fittings on a Schwerin HSF then HSF's by Schwerin are fake/fantasies/garbage/postwar/made for vets.

Hi John,

I fully agree, and yet this combo is very strange. It makes sense for leftover parts in Germany to be slapped together for post-war profits as we often see, whereas surprising to see the combo here. If the French-made badges were produced, stored and eventually leaked from France without turning up in Germany until decades later, there wasn't a lot of opportunity for someone to marry leftover "French" hardware with a German Deumer planchet before 1970. It's a mystery how these components would come together before then, and why someone would so carefully marry them and pack them in the correct carton and tissue paper.

Put another way, if someone had a "French-made" badge in the correct packaging but the hardware separated, I could see someone perhaps attaching new hardware to the badge to repair it, but not chucking the badge instead and putting the hardware on a German badge and then back into the "French-made" packaging. The whole thing is just weird except as a social experiment.

Cheers,
---Norm