Unnumbered Blood Orders?

[ErichS]

I remember hearing stories of unnumbered 2nd pattern Blood Orders being discovered in Germany back in the 80's. Does anyone have any details or have seen such pieces?

[Jon Fish]

Erich I too have heard these stories.However I was not collecting seriously until the mid 80's. I have never come across one of these unumbered examples.Legend has it they were 'numbered' by dealers back then and sold as numbered second patterns.Does any one have a picture of an original un issued Blutorden? or of this 'hoard'?

[ErichS]

Thanks Jon for your reply. I think until one is discovered it my only be a collecting myth. But then of course we may never know if they were numbered post 1945.

[Panzer Rob]

Thanks Jon for your reply. I think until one is discovered it my only be a collecting myth. But then of course we may never know if they were numbered post 1945.

I too would love to see one of these "supposed" post-war numbered Blutorden created from un-numbered examples found after the war.

I often wonder if these "post-war numbered" Blutorden which older collectors refer to (yet - AFAIK - have yet to ever materialize) are in fact the "non-textbook" numbered first patterns; those with the issue number under the silver content mark... the ones which we now know beyond any doubt are in fact 100% original

Rob

[ErichS]

From what I have heard Rob these unnumbered examples were all 2nd patterns per Steve Wolfe.

[Erich B.]

Correct--it was a small batch of 2nd type BOs that was found. I don't know whether they were the 2 'early' 2nd types or the late 2nd type, although I suspect they may have been the latter.
Erich

[ErichS]

Erich, Niemann also makes mention of these 2nd pattern BO's in his Price Guide.

[Jon Fish]

Cool guys. I wonder if any old time dealer will be brave enough to pipe up with a photo of an unumbered example. More to the point I wonder how many of these are still unnumbered? not many I suspect. I would really love to see one as my theory is the 4000-4200 range of medals we see might well include some of these that have had numbers added, as the font on those real late Blutorden issue numbers apears 'strange' at times.
Erich-how many had been discovered and by whom? also are you aware of them having numbers added to increase value?

[Max_Porter]

My unnumbered Blood Order

Hello dear Blood-Order-Collectors,

reading this very interesting thread I perceived the request to show Blood Orders without a number - and today I will do so ….

The Story:

In 2004 I had the chance to buy a blood order in the 2.300 # range directly from a recipients family. The seller told me, that they`d found some medal stuff (including the blood order medal) in the house where they lived with their huge family for a few generation years and so they did´nt know exactly who the original recipient was. I asked a few times for possible names without success…. He then gave me two names who could have been the owner but none of them was a blood order recipient. My opinion then was that he did´nt want to tell the real name and so I stopped asking. My intention then was to simply buy the single medal without a name.

Then the day came when I bought the blood order. While talking about the price of it the seller told me that he has “another one in better condition”. I was confused and asked for the number. He told me that it has none! He then showed a near mint blood order without a number to me and said that it was found with the numbered one in an enevelope! And then I could buy both and that was very happy moment.

That´s the story, not more or less. No information about the recipient, no information about the unnumbered medal.

These are just my thoughts: The seller did´nt want to tell the real name of his relative who originally got the medal. Referring to its number it was awarded by the “Vorschlagsliste Nr. XI” (recommendation list – Patzwall) of 26th of august 1939. I believe that the recipient (from the Mannheim area) contemporary ordered or tried to get another/a second medal by the Schidthäussler factory (or maybe by Fuess). Maybe they told him that he just would be able or allowed to get an unnumbered one and a numbered one could only come by the Reichsschatzmeister (Franz Xaver Schwarz)– we or I will never know. No facts.

Fact is that the medal without number is near mint and a 100 % original keeper. To me it is simply a dream with a wonderful toning. It has the exact flaw the numbered one has so I believe in a production time within 1939 to 1941. There has never been a number in it. It´s weight is 22, 28 gr.

I have a Niemann COA from 2004 for this beauty. The pictures are the best I have at the moment.

Hope you´ll enjoy it and best regards

Max_Porter


P.S.: Of course it is in no way for sale….

[Max_Porter]

Detail:

[Max_Porter]

Another Reverse:

[Max_Porter]

Front 1:

[Max_Porter]

And the last: Front 2 - Enjoy it ....

[Jon Fish]

So there we have a second pattern,early issue. Nothing wrong with that one! Thanks for the pics! Lovely original medal.

[ErichS]

Very nice BO Max! So it seems that the blank BO'S could have possibly been an extra wearing copy which could be purchased by the recipient. It makes sense because extras could be purchased of other high awards such as the RK and GPBs.