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    Vienna Conglomorate - More evidence to "Who is Wernstein"

    Hi guys,

    Instead of hijacking Franks original "Who is Wernstein" thread or Marc more recent thread on the subject, I figured I would break this one out separately. As most of you know, I've been researching the CCCs for a future book. From a distance, it appears that there are many unmarked CCCs, which is a big reason there is not a huge interest in them and why many collectors shy away from them.

    Upon studying them, I have determined that all the unmarked clasps can be narrowed to just 3 different makers. 1 of them I believe strongly to be S&L for several reasons and I have posted my theory in another thread. That leaves only 2 others left to be identified and linked to makers. Both of these share the same obverse design as Rudolf Souval CCCs. Not only do they share the same obverse DESIGN, they share the EXACT SAME DIE!

    This is yet more evidence that there was a VIENNA based conglomorate of makers sharing dies and hardware. I will post pics of a Rudolf Souval clasp (marked RS) and then the two others. The definative link is the top left oakleaf in the central motif, notice the striations at the leaf tip, the exact same on all three CCCs.
    Attached Files
    If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

    New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
    [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

    #2
    RS-reverse

    rs-central motif
    Attached Files
    If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

    New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
    [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

    Comment


      #3
      RS-Oakleaf closeup

      rs-oakleaf
      Attached Files
      If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

      New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
      [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
      Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

      Comment


        #4
        RS-Reverse

        RS-reverse
        Attached Files
        If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

        New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
        [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
        Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

        Comment


          #5
          Now-Semi-circular punch CCC

          Obverse
          Attached Files
          If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

          New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
          [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
          Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

          Comment


            #6
            Semicircle - Central Motif

            Motif
            Attached Files
            If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

            New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
            [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
            Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

            Comment


              #7
              Oakleaf Closeup

              Oakleaf
              Attached Files
              If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

              New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
              [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
              Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

              Comment


                #8
                Reverse

                reverse
                Attached Files
                If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                Comment


                  #9
                  Now - 6 dot crimp CCC

                  Obverse
                  Attached Files
                  If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                  New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                  [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                  Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                  Comment


                    #10
                    6 Dot - Motif

                    Motif
                    Attached Files
                    If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                    New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                    [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                    Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                    Comment


                      #11
                      6 Dot - Oakleaf closeup

                      Oakleaf
                      Attached Files
                      If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                      New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                      [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                      Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Focus on this area

                        Striations
                        Attached Files
                        If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                        New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                        [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                        Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                        Comment


                          #13
                          6-Dot - Reverse

                          Reverse
                          Attached Files
                          If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                          New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                          [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                          Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                          Comment


                            #14
                            6-Dot - Pin

                            Pin
                            Attached Files
                            If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                            New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                            [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                            Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                            Comment


                              #15
                              OK, thats all the pics.

                              These 2 unmarked clasps share the exact same die with Rudolf Souval, so more than likely the makers of the unmarked clasps were Vienna firms or close by.

                              Also, the pin on the "semi-circular" crimp CCC is a close match to the pins sometimes used on the "W in a circle with 5 marks" IABs, which is looking more and more to be one of the Vienna firms as well. I can find no other evidence to support this despite may months of searching. I am hoping some of you guys can add to this theory and possibly identify one or both of the makers before my book is published. The catch on the "semi-circular" crimp CCC is quite unique, and all that has come to light so far is a similar catch on an IAB marked L/10 (Deschler, Munich) and on a wound badge, marked L/24 (Fritz Zimmerman, Stuttgart).

                              What are your thoughts, comments, additions, etc??

                              Regards

                              Tom D.
                              If it doesn't have a hinge and catch, I'm not interested......well, maybe a little

                              New Book - The German Close Combat Clasp of World War II
                              [/SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
                              Available Now - tmdurante@gmail.com

                              Comment

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