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**HIAG** · 06-11-2005, 02:30 PM

Originally posted by Jarrid Marsh

Plate is 100% correct, get a shot of the 4 O'clock position in a closeup and can confirm it. Reading too much into this one and price is 4-500 american.

J

Are you saying that holding the plate at a certain angle the "C" appears???

And that these plates are being sold in the USA for between $400-500 or $4,500 ??

Regards Hiag

**Jarrid Marsh** · 06-11-2005, 04:37 PM

Originally posted by HIAG

Are you saying that holding the plate at a certain angle the "C" appears???

And that these plates are being sold in the USA for between $400-500 or $4,500 ??

Regards Hiag

No the transfer is numbered between the 3 and 4'o clock position 400-500 in minty condition. These may not be allach either.

J

**HIAG** · 06-11-2005, 08:13 PM

Originally posted by Jarrid Marsh

No the transfer is numbered between the 3 and 4'o clock position 400-500 in minty condition. These may not be allach either.

J

Sorry I dont wish to appear argumentative, but are you saying that these plates can be picked up in mint condition in the USA for between $400-$500??? and that they're not made by Allach??? If so I must certainly disagree on the latter part of your statement, the 1944 Julfest plate was certainly made by the Allach factory, secondly I would certainly be interested in purchasing any mint ones you turn up for $400-500.

Regards Hiag

**Jarrid Marsh** · 06-11-2005, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by HIAG

Sorry I dont wish to appear argumentative, but are you saying that these plates can be picked up in mint condition in the USA for between $400-$500??? and that they're not made by Allach??? If so I must certainly disagree on the latter part of your statement, the 1944 Julfest plate was certainly made by the Allach factory, secondly I would certainly be interested in purchasing any mint ones you turn up for $400-500.

Regards Hiag

Well you can argue if you like, but I will address it anyway. As far as price goes 2 went unsold in herman historicas last auction at 250-300 euro 1 recent ebay unsold at 400.00 u.s.

As far as Allach is concerned its a legitimate argument, as this is a commercial Juhlfest plate first off, but regardless the 44 Pohl plates bear no resemblence whatsoever of previous years in either presentation or commercial in regards to color or feel, however they do resemble a pattern of Bohemia porcelain with the same blueish hue and quality.

Bohemia porcelain manufatured dinnerware and such for hotels and private sale and can be found here and there with its wartime mark. It had Rosenthal ownership up until 1940 at which time they got out and thier manufacture mark changed at the same time to a "B" with the ss cultural marks set inside the arc, at the same time this occured a top officer of Bohemia moved over to Allach in an advisory role, however Oswald Pohls wife remained and was a porcelain afficionado in her own right and they maintained that mark until wars end 1945, so Bohemia was not only an SS entity and had patterned porcelain much the same as this plate, but the head of SS economic concerns wife worked there, Mrs. Oswald Pohl.

Plate is unmarked has a blue hue and resembles very closely Bohemia porcelain more so than Allach, so I would ask if you have proof in some form that allach made this particular plate?. I would like to see it as I have tried to figure it out myself, but dont believe that it is Allach.

And the plate pictured in the thread is correct, I can see the mark on the front, and the rear of these plates for some reason I dont know why, the dedication if hit with a cleaner or something will come off, as I have seen them with parts of the dedications worn off.

J

**HIAG** · 06-11-2005, 10:01 PM

Originally posted by Jarrid Marsh

Well you can argue if you like, but I will address it anyway. As far as price goes 2 went unsold in herman historicas last auction at 250-300 euro 1 recent ebay unsold at 400.00 u.s.

As far as Allach is concerned its a legitimate argument, as this is a commercial Juhlfest plate first off, but regardless the 44 Pohl plates bear no resemblence whatsoever of previous years in either presentation or commercial in regards to color or feel, however they do resemble a pattern of Bohemia porcelain with the same blueish hue and quality.

Bohemia porcelain manufatured dinnerware and such for hotels and private sale and can be found here and there with its wartime mark. It had Rosenthal ownership up until 1940 at which time they got out and thier manufacture mark changed at the same time to a "B" with the ss cultural marks set inside the arc, at the same time this occured a top officer of Bohemia moved over to Allach in an advisory role, however Oswald Pohls wife remained and was a porcelain afficionado in her own right and they maintained that mark until wars end 1945, so Bohemia was not only an SS entity and had patterned porcelain much the same as this plate, but the head of SS economic concerns wife worked there, Mrs. Oswald Pohl.

Plate is unmarked has a blue hue and resembles very closely Bohemia porcelain more so than Allach, so I would ask if you have proof in some form that allach made this particular plate?. I would like to see it as I have tried to figure it out myself, but dont believe that it is Allach.

And the plate pictured in the thread is correct, I can see the mark on the front, and the rear of these plates for some reason I dont know why, the dedication if hit with a cleaner or something will come off, as I have seen them with parts of the dedications worn off.

J

Yes I see where you're coming from,but was it a commercially produced plate? I've never seen one without the Pohl inscription on the reverse, also I believe the general concensus is its an Allach made piece, but what you're saying makes a lot of sense it is unlike all the other julfest plates, but could it have been a plate he commisioned himself ? I suppose we'll never know.Just an afterthought did Bohemia Porcelain catalogue any other julfest plates?

Regards Hiag

**Jarrid Marsh** · 06-11-2005, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by HIAG

Yes I see where you're coming from,but was it a commercially produced plate? I've never seen one without the Pohl inscription on the reverse, also I believe the general concensus is its an Allach made piece, but what you're saying makes a lot of sense it is unlike all the other julfest plates, but could it have been a plate he commisioned himself ? I suppose we'll never know.Just an afterthought did Bohemia Porcelain catalogue any other julfest plates?

Regards Hiag

Hiag,

That is the only unmarked Juhfest plate that I can think of commercial or presentation, and all Allach is pure white accept for painted pieces and none whatsoever resemble that plate, the 43 commercial has a Pohl dedication to the rear, but its bright white as is the 44 presentation, so im speculating and not certain but its not an uncommon plate, I have one here thats mint and they are out there. So I just looked at the plate and researched it a bit and found the above info and based an opinion that there is a possibility that they did not manufacture it. I would say no to any other commisioned plates, why they would make a 44 presentation and not the commercial I cant answer either other than maybe politics or lack of personel due to the late stage of the war, we do know some pieces could notr be commisioned that late even for Himmler.

Best,

Jarrid

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