Unknown visor

[Vaughn O.]

Hi, Is there anyone out there that could tell me what this visor is? I suspect it's an early post-war West German government cap. Maybe a a BGS cap? While the maker (Carl Halfar) did make caps during WWII, the company continued after the war and the label mark is different than that of WWII. This verson appears on another West German cap I have. I think someone stuck a NSDAP eagle on this piece.

Thanks,

[Vaughn O.]

Interior

[Vaughn O.]

Here's a West German cap with the same maker's label. What is this cap, by the way. Maybe an early Berlin police cap or???

Thanks, Vaughn

[Vaughn O.]

Interior

[Vaughn O.]

Here's a Carl Halfar wartime Luftwaffe NCO cap interior. I guess I'm answering my own questions, aren't I? I would like to get an ID on the two West German caps, though.

Vaughn

[Donald Abenheim]

interessant

Your 2d cap is Berlin police of the early period, although they also wore a Tschako. Your 1st cap I have no idea, other than maybe forestry in Berlin. It is difficult to find such early caps in my experience and I am sure these have begun to have some value, as well. Are these for sale?

[Vaughn O.]

HI Donald, Thanks for the information. At this point, I'm going to hang on to them.

Vaughn

[Donald Abenheim]

sehr richtig

I have spent a lot of time in Berlin Troedelmaerkte, including militaria dealers and I have never seen such things, save perhaps the grey police uniforms. Granted that the cold war is itself ein Sammelgebiet, you'd do well to retain such headwear. The yellow and red cockade on the cap with green facings, though, signifies some other Bundesland and city, I am sure, than Berlin. Maybe it is a forestry cap of some kind. You might write to the uniform people at the Zeughaus in Berlin, that is, the people who helped Wilkins write his book.

[leigh kitchen]

Is the green cap anything to do with judicial? Rough late wartime cap finished off with just post war makers stamps etc?

[SvenWittnebel]

...

[uscob]

It's an early West Berlin BVG (Berliner Verkehrsgesellschaft) Public Transport Cap. The BVG Shield is missing (If you need one, I have them. I is located were the eagle is.
The red/silver cocade is in the city colours. The Wreath means that he "Served" over 25 Years.
Nico

[SvenWittnebel]

BVG-(West) = Berliner Verkehrsbetriebe.

Eagle? The police star and the grey visor hat with federal cockade means - this is a West-Berlin WACHPOLIZEI hat (circa '60 - 76). The wreath is a fake.

Or did You mean the first visor (the green one, pre-wall)? Then BVG means Berliner Vekehrsgesellschaft.

[uscob]

BVG-(West) = Berliner Verkehrsbetriebe.

Eagle? The police star and the grey visor hat with federal cockade means - this is a West-Berlin WACHPOLIZEI hat (circa '60 - 76). The wreath is a fake.

Or did You mean the first visor (the green one, pre-wall)? Then BVG means Berliner Vekehrsgesellschaft.

When I write Gesellschaft, I mean it. Later they changed to Verkehrbetriebe. I'ts the first style Cap.
Why do you think the wreath on the Police Cap is a fake? To me it looks ok. They had them in both styles, I bought directly from the Depot (Kleiderkammer).
Nico

[SvenWittnebel]

Mmh, I grow up in Reinickendorf, for some years in Tegel, Brunowstra******223;e, in the house where my grandparents lived and also the Polizeirevier 27 and the Meldestelle was located. As a little boy I had a lot of contact with the Schutz- and Wachpolizisten there, I simply never saw one (Wapo) with the wreath on his visor hat.

I had also take a look into my only book on this subject, Die Berliner Polizei von 1945 bis zur Gegenwart (1998), Jaron Verlag.
All photos of Wapos are pre grey uniform (circa 1955 - '76 with this visor hat/police star, until circa '90 other grey uniforms and the same star as today).

Where did You buy the hat, Friesenstra******223;e, Zentralbekleidungskammer?
We must make a date with miss Dr. Sch******246;nfelder at the Polizeihistorische Sammlung.

And an other here: BVG-Archiv, Uferstra******223;e 8-11, 13357 Berlin. (The BVG was still called so after 1949 but was a Eigenbetrieb der Stadt Berlin (West), a different sort of company as a Gesellschaft.)

PS.: http://gdp-koeln.de/gdp_mambo/statem...achpolizei.pdf

[Gordon Craig]

Gentlemen,

I'd like to add my two cents to this discussion. The first cap could be a BVG cap of an early type although I have never seen one just like it. Here are some pictures of my BVG visor cap for comparison. There is no sign that there ever was a cockade or wreath on my cap.

Regards,

Gordon