EK 1 1914 who is the maker?

[Stew]

I attach an EK .The pin and its attachment point have been removed. Is it possible to establish the maker? Also are there any theories as to why the EK should be in this incomplete (vandalised) state? Do you think there may have been a practical reason to remove the attachment? Thanks.

[Stew]

obverse of EK1

[Stew]

close up of lower front of EK1 showing details.
The EK affects the pointers of a compass - so it is magnetic ?
Hope this helps establish a maker?
Thanks.

[streptile]

EK is by S-W, which I think is Sy & Wagner.

Not sure why the pin is gone. Probably just broken off.

In my opinion, S-W got a hold of the old Type B 1870 core molds (presumed to have been Godet's) for these early sand-cast cores (which yours is). The '1914' date is the only thing that's different, both front and back, from the 1870 Type B cores, on early S-W sand-cast EK2s.

Check out four EK2s from my collection. The top two are Type B 1870s, the bottom two are S-W marked 1914s.



Now the fronts:



It's something I noticed only a few weeks ago.

[Mike Kenny]

From memory, S-W EK1s never used the "oval" hingeplate (which is a feature found on EK1s by very few makers). More likely WS, who shared most of their 3 or 4 EK1 cores with S-W. Stew, if you look extremely closely, you may find a weakly stamped marking near the remnants of the catch. Hard to say why the catch was removed, but it may have something to do with the obverse damaged (cracked) core, which appears to have taken a sharp impact between the W and date. Cast iron core cracks parallel to the arm edges are unusual, unless struck by something. Cracks normally go from one sdie of the arm to the other and tend to be around the W (commonly associated with bent arms). It's always possiblw the main pin (any maybe catch) were "cannibalised" to repair an example with pristine core.

Regards
Mike

[Kraal]

For me it`s a Wagner and Son type2 with a different core. Some pieces weren´t marked anyway.

[Montgomery Burns]

most important,,,,,,it brings ( date's) the ek 1870 b type production to 1900/1914 in my opinion.


nice ,,,,

[Montgomery Burns]

and yes indeed it is a sy & wagner hinge .
the core is not necessary to be from s & w


as a lot off jewellers they where using a lot off different core's
this is just on off them


http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=263592

regards kay

[Montgomery Burns]

lll

[Stew]

thanks for your comments everyone.
Firstly there is no evidence of a weak makers stamping close to the catch.

secondly,the EK has an east- west crack under the W but the nth-sth crack is interesting because it was caused by pressure caused by a blow from the obverse sideat the bottom. If you look at the above lower front side picture of the "1914" you will see that the fluting on the bottom of the EK has been flattened and the bottom strip shows evidence of being bowed inwards by a blow being struck at the back at the bottom. It may have been subsequently straightened.
Under the 1 and 4 of the "1914" it still bows slightly inward.On the obverse side at the left of the bottom catch is evidence of a contact that caused the damage on the front side.
This medal was gifted to me and it belonged to the the donor's grandfather or great grandfather. I must ask whether he knows anything about the circumstances leading to this damage. There might be an interesting story
best regards Stew

[Mike Kenny]

and yes indeed it is a sy & wagner hinge .
the core is not necessary to be from s & w....

That's contratictory. You say it's an S-W (Sy & Wagner) and then you show a WS (Wagner & Sohn).

Stew, what's in the circled area - I can see a tiny stamped W.S. from the pic!

Regards
Mike

[streptile]

That's contratictory. You say it's an S-W (Sy & Wagner) and then you show a WS (Wagner & Sohn).

Hi Mike. I think he meant to write WS.

In any event, I wasn't aware that WS used this same early cast core. It is one I have only found in S-W. Do you know what the nature of the relationship between those two jewelers was, beyond sharing cores? Anything.

[streptile]

most important,,,,,,it brings ( date's) the ek 1870 b type production to 1900/1914 in my opinion.


nice ,,,,

Thanks Kay.

I agree that this is an interesting discovery (and others made it simultaneously with, or before, me), and I happen to agree with your conclusion, although I don't think the existence of the same reverse mold necessarily leads to that conclusion.

I also know that Type A 1870 EK2s were available until at least 1915 for purchase.

[Mike Kenny]

In any event, I wasn't aware that WS used this same early cast core. It is one I have only found in S-W. Do you know what the nature of the relationship between those two jewelers was, beyond sharing cores? Anything.

Hi Trevor,

Nothing concrete. Both were Berlin. Both used multiple core types (3 or 4 each). Both shared cores (and probably frames but I have not studied that. The plain "W" marked EKs also fit into the picture somehow (I think IW EK2s are also included). All of the Wagner jewellers were of the "extended" Wagner family (brothers, uncles, etc) as far as I know.

I think I've read something of their relationships before, but a German member will probably be able to clarify.

Regards
Mike

[streptile]

All of the Wagner jewellers were of the "extended" Wagner family (brothers, uncles, etc) as far as I know.

I find that fascinating. Thank you, Mike. I would be very interested in further information about their precise relationship if anyone knows any.