Quantity of K&Q Knight's Crosses

[Bob Hritz]

In the last few years, I have noticed an abbundance of K&Q Knight's Crosses on the market. Had someone found a bunch left over after the war? K&Q now seems easy to find, moreso, than in decades past.

Bob Hritz

[Peter Wiking]

Hmm...
With this abbundance, will the prize drop so that i could buy one of those ?

Cheers.
Peter Wiking

[Peter B]

Hi Bob
I believe a number of cased unissued K&Q RK's were located somewhere in Germany or Europe a few years ago, however maybe some others may have more info. on this.

[Biro]

Bob

The 'abundance' of K&Q about has been discussed before here many times, and stems, (from what I've read, although no matter how hard I search, I can't actually find the words from the 'horses' mouth - sorry Gordon) partly from a comment Gordon W apparently made about K&Q dies surviving the war.

I could be way off beam here, so I don't want to throw unsubstantiated quotes about...but I also beleive he qualified the statement with the fact that 'survivng dies' and 'finished, composite and convincing' K&Q RK's with period materials are two entirely different matters...

I'm sure there are many private opinions out there that will, unfortunately, remain private, but whatever the truth, the K&Q RK dosen't seem to attract anywhere NEAR the same bad press that, for example, a flawed S&L does...

I hope so....I have a vested interest... so please, discuss away gentlemen...




Marshall

[Gordon Williamson]

Bob

The 'abundance' of K&Q about has been discussed before here many times, and stems, (from what I've read, although no matter how hard I search, I can't actually find the words from the 'horses' mouth - sorry Gordon) partly from a comment Gordon W apparently made about K&Q dies surviving the war.

I could be way off beam here, so I don't want to throw unsubstantiated quotes about...but I also beleive he qualified the statement with the fact that 'survivng dies' and 'finished, composite and convincing' K&Q RK's with period materials are two entirely different matters...

I'm sure there are many private opinions out there that will, unfortunately, remain private, but whatever the truth, the K&Q RK dosen't seem to attract anywhere NEAR the same bad press that, for example, a flawed S&L does...

I hope so....I have a vested interest... so please, discuss away gentlemen...




Marshall

I had some correspondence a few years back with a German collector whose father worked in the K & Q firm. Their dies certainly survived the war and remained with the firm for quite a while (the firm made household objects after the war). They eventually sold off all their tooling and any remaining stocks of awards lying in storage (this guys father grabbed the EK1 dies as a souvenir , probably some of the other employees took stuff also). I don't know specifically what happened to the RK dies at that point but was told some of the tooling was sold to a America (the tooling for the naval badges was specifically mentioned).

The tooling presumably still survives though I've seen or heard no evidence of it being used for restrikes.

[Biro]

There ya go Bob........I thought it was something along those lines...

Personally, I feel that story is probably not going to 'rock' the market any - I've heard worse.....and the ever increasing price of K&Q RK is testament to that fact.

Thanks for taking the time to clarify this Gordon.

Marshall

[Luftm40]

KQ crosses have a very distinctive shape, so you can spot them in wartime portraits pretty easily. Judging from the pictures I have studied, they were fairly common, especially w/ later war recipients. I think, in general, the 65 KQ crosses were awarded later in the war...43-45. They are also very common in later war award groupings.....

[Robin Lumsden]

There was a fake K&Q cross posted on one of these forums just the other day. I can't recall if it was GDC or the Axis Forum. I think it was the latter. It was very well made, but certainly a reproduction. The die striking was different, and the last '9' in '1939' was raised above the level of the other letters. It had the distinctive K&Q shape and 'doughnut' ring and I am sure that it would fool a great many collectors. That might explain why Bob has noticed more K&Qs about these days. I've noticed the same.

[ChrisJ]

Dies ?

Gordon....did your contact say if the dies referred to the frames or the core ?
I've noticed on the fake market what appear to be some nice frames with poor cores.
Regards
Chris

[Robin Lumsden]

Here's the fake K&Q. Fairly good, but not good enough.

[Robin Lumsden]

'65' loop stamp.

[Robin Lumsden]

And an original for comparison.

[tom hansen]

And an original for comparison.

Robin- That looks like a souval core (on the fake) with the dipping "3". Do most of the fakes you have seen have this core as well? I cannot make out the details of the beading on the fake. Does it match up well with the original or not? Thanks

[Gordon Williamson]

Here's the fake K&Q. Fairly good, but not good enough.

Looks to me like a Souval with a fake 65 marked loop. It has the distinctive dropped 3 in the 1939, textbook Souval.